May 2009
Tae Kwon Do forms
31/May/09
Here is a recent email I received and my reply.
Mr. Yates,
It is an honor to be emailing you. I grew up studying your forms book - we learned all 12 forms from it, and later, Ge Baek when the newer edition came out. I still have my original tattered copy from the 80s. Your book was the perfect reference tool for us and helped us to achieve our ranks. I intend to pass the book on to one of my senior students soon, as it is a piece of our history and of great value to me. That book has laid in the yard while I practiced forms as a child, been taped, taped again, and used in every classroom I've taught TKD in since I was a child.
Are you demonstrating these forms in an older tradition than the ITF teaches now? I've noticed they added in the "sine wave" or the bouncing up and down on each movement, as well as having a more universal "X" fold for most blocks with the blocking hand going on the inside, etc. When I look at forms from their source material now, it is a different type of folding and moving than what ITF teachings now - so I thought maybe you were doing an older version of the way Gen. Choi did them? Also, moves like the first move on Yul-Gok appear to be completely different - you demonstrate an open palm movement, and when you watch any ITF person do it on youtube.com or on their legacy cd rom, they just step out and focus a fist, then punch, punch. I was just curious about the history on this. Of the source material I've seen over my time in TKD study, it looks as if maybe you are teaching the forms closer to the way he taught them at an earlier point - and I've never seen one of your forms that talks about the sine wave.... If you have time I'd love to hear your thoughts.
Chad Boxx
St. Louis, MO
Chad, Here is the short answer. I learned the Chang Hon patterns (they didn't call them the ITF forms yet because there wasn't a ITF) in 1967 a year before I made black belt. Jhoon Rhee had sent word we would be changing from the Tang Soo Do forms that we had been using up to that point. Those were actually Shotokan kata with Korean names.
The Chang Hon patterns were really close to the previous Japanese kata, in fact, almost the same techniques just in a different order. We learned them via eight-millimeter movie film that Mr. Rhee mailed to Dallas (Rhee himself was the demonstrator). We projected them on the back wall of the dojo and all the black and brown belts tried to learn them from that grainy footage. I am sure some variations crept in that way.
Over the years I, and others, have modified the individual techniques to make them more practical in our experience (of course every style and school over the last three hundred years has does the same thing). The "sine" wave is a recent addition (I don't know if I would call it an improvement) by the ITF to make their forms stand apart from the WTF patterns.
So bottom line, yes, we do the forms pretty close to the way they were first designed with probably a few modifications (like that open palm at the first of Yul-Gok). That's one reason I make a point of saying we are "American Tae Kwon Do," or often we just say "American karate." After all, our forms are really just Japanese kata with a few differences in sequence.
Hope this helps,
Keith Yates
Mr. Yates,
It is an honor to be emailing you. I grew up studying your forms book - we learned all 12 forms from it, and later, Ge Baek when the newer edition came out. I still have my original tattered copy from the 80s. Your book was the perfect reference tool for us and helped us to achieve our ranks. I intend to pass the book on to one of my senior students soon, as it is a piece of our history and of great value to me. That book has laid in the yard while I practiced forms as a child, been taped, taped again, and used in every classroom I've taught TKD in since I was a child.
Are you demonstrating these forms in an older tradition than the ITF teaches now? I've noticed they added in the "sine wave" or the bouncing up and down on each movement, as well as having a more universal "X" fold for most blocks with the blocking hand going on the inside, etc. When I look at forms from their source material now, it is a different type of folding and moving than what ITF teachings now - so I thought maybe you were doing an older version of the way Gen. Choi did them? Also, moves like the first move on Yul-Gok appear to be completely different - you demonstrate an open palm movement, and when you watch any ITF person do it on youtube.com or on their legacy cd rom, they just step out and focus a fist, then punch, punch. I was just curious about the history on this. Of the source material I've seen over my time in TKD study, it looks as if maybe you are teaching the forms closer to the way he taught them at an earlier point - and I've never seen one of your forms that talks about the sine wave.... If you have time I'd love to hear your thoughts.
Chad Boxx
St. Louis, MO
Chad, Here is the short answer. I learned the Chang Hon patterns (they didn't call them the ITF forms yet because there wasn't a ITF) in 1967 a year before I made black belt. Jhoon Rhee had sent word we would be changing from the Tang Soo Do forms that we had been using up to that point. Those were actually Shotokan kata with Korean names.
The Chang Hon patterns were really close to the previous Japanese kata, in fact, almost the same techniques just in a different order. We learned them via eight-millimeter movie film that Mr. Rhee mailed to Dallas (Rhee himself was the demonstrator). We projected them on the back wall of the dojo and all the black and brown belts tried to learn them from that grainy footage. I am sure some variations crept in that way.
Over the years I, and others, have modified the individual techniques to make them more practical in our experience (of course every style and school over the last three hundred years has does the same thing). The "sine" wave is a recent addition (I don't know if I would call it an improvement) by the ITF to make their forms stand apart from the WTF patterns.
So bottom line, yes, we do the forms pretty close to the way they were first designed with probably a few modifications (like that open palm at the first of Yul-Gok). That's one reason I make a point of saying we are "American Tae Kwon Do," or often we just say "American karate." After all, our forms are really just Japanese kata with a few differences in sequence.
Hope this helps,
Keith Yates
Summer is Almost Here!
06/May/09
As we approach Memorial Day weekend the AKaTo is gearing up for the hot Texas summer. In fact, on that Sunday, May 24th, AKaTo black belt, Mark Lynn (remember, he did the last knife fighting class), is hosting one of his Arnis instructors at the Richardson YMCA. The class will run from 2 to 4 pm and the fee is just $25. I know it is a holiday weekend and, in fact, I won’t be able to be there myself, but you will benefit from the experience of a great martial artist if you aren’t out of town yourself.
And speaking of old instructors, my old jujutsu teacher, Ted Gambordella, has offered to do a black belt continuing education class this summer (probably July). I’ll let you know when we finalize the date.
I won’t be at the second Kobudo class this Saturday because we are going to Shreveport to see our daughter-in-law graduate from college (Rodney’s wife). Rodney, by the way, just started a new job in Virginia as a civilian contractor to the military teaching the same kind of stuff he did on the warship in the Navy. And he reports that there is a tae kwon do school near his new place and he plans to check it out soon.
As some of you travel this summer you might do the same thing and visit some martial arts schools wherever you are. As I have done that over the years I am always reminded that we, in the AKaTo, have some of the finest students and teachers of the arts anywhere in the country. And remember, to always conduct yourself with humility and courtesy when you do visit other dojos.
And speaking of old instructors, my old jujutsu teacher, Ted Gambordella, has offered to do a black belt continuing education class this summer (probably July). I’ll let you know when we finalize the date.
I won’t be at the second Kobudo class this Saturday because we are going to Shreveport to see our daughter-in-law graduate from college (Rodney’s wife). Rodney, by the way, just started a new job in Virginia as a civilian contractor to the military teaching the same kind of stuff he did on the warship in the Navy. And he reports that there is a tae kwon do school near his new place and he plans to check it out soon.
As some of you travel this summer you might do the same thing and visit some martial arts schools wherever you are. As I have done that over the years I am always reminded that we, in the AKaTo, have some of the finest students and teachers of the arts anywhere in the country. And remember, to always conduct yourself with humility and courtesy when you do visit other dojos.